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Monday, June 21, 2010

Art Gallery Owners 6-18-2010

The following is a chat log from the 6-18-2010 meeting of the Art Gallery Owners group about the Linden Endowment for the Arts (LEA) project. It may look like I'm a bit slow replying and missed a lot of questions but the reality is that there were just a zillion questions and comments flying so fast I could not keep up! It was simply impossible to answer every question, but there is a lot of great feedback here I will be taking back to the committee. Please read and post your comments!

I have not had time to sort through this and post some answers to some of the missed questions, I'll try to get to that soon and post them here as comments.

Sasun Steinbeck: Welcome everyone! Glad you could make it. Before we get started, first a few ground rules. Please keep the conversations civil, polite, and ON TOPIC. I'll be slow to respond if you IM me since I will probably be doing 10 things at once during the hour.
Sasun Steinbeck: Please hold questions for a moment until I open the floor for questions, thanks.
Sasun Steinbeck: This talk will be saved and logged and sent to the entire group. If you say anything, I'm going to assume you are ok with allowing me to log this discussion, distribute it, and post it on my blog.
Sasun Steinbeck: Our agenda today: the Linden Endowment for the Arts (LEA). If you have not seen our first update, please take a quick look at http://blogs.secondlife.com/community/community/blog/2010/06/16/linden-endowment-for-the-arts-update
Sasun Steinbeck: For a list of committee members, see http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Linden_Lab_Official:Linden_Endowment_for_the_Arts_Committee
Sasun Steinbeck: In the update blog post, 5 high-level goals were listed. The committee will be hard at work turning those goals into specific plans to accomplish them. The purpose of the meeting today is to get your feedback as valuable members of the art community and raise any concerns you may have.
Sasun Steinbeck: I'd like to open the floor to questions and feedback. I will be taking your feedback back to the committee for us to consider as we work up our plans in the near future. Thank you!
Sasun Steinbeck: one piece of feedback that I've heard is that people don't want the LEA projects to "compete" with existing art galleries and art sims in SL
Chloe Mineff: Susposedly they won't according to the blog
Skylarian Isachenko: I am wondering if there will be a way to sell RL art via SL so that we do not have to mess with the fuss of revealing identies for those that are sensitive about it
Sasun Steinbeck: hm interesting question, it may be unavoidable since you are shipping a RL item to a RL address
Lizzo Dreamscape: ok. read the update. Question already: will this affect Burning Life? (I love Burning Life)
Skylarian Isachenko: Unless LL provided a billing system and shipping system we could use, yes.
Sasun Steinbeck: selling RL art is something that we hope comes as a consequence of promiting virtual art in SL but not something we will be working on specifically, I don't think
Petal Fairlock: you could use a po box with your avatar name
Sasun Steinbeck: hm no, this won't change Burning LIfe at all
Skylarian Isachenko: Well, I did not expect it would be, but it was a question.
FreeWee Ling: Doesn't there have to be a feed before there can be feedback? I've feel there's been a real lack of transparency and information about LEA.
Sasun Steinbeck: yes FreeWee I agree, the recent blog post is a start to getting more info out
Sasun Steinbeck: there really isn't a lot to share, we don't have detailed plans to even share yet
FreeWee Ling: I know several people who signed up for at the original request for participation and no one ever heard a thing.
Sasun Steinbeck: Yeah I assume that LL didn't contact everyone that applied, since I've heard that from lots of others
FreeWee Ling: An acknowledgement would have been nice.
Sasun Steinbeck: I can't speak for them so I'm not sure what the policy was on that. Yes I agree, that's a good piece of feedback I'll take back, thank you
Skylarian Isachenko: An endowment sort of means someone spending money for the arts, but I take it we will not see any of that on a personal basis
Soundsmith Kamachi: The defition of art is an intersting question, will this be a very strict or loose one?
Elise Benusconi: Sasun, would it be asking too much to get an overview of the sort of work you have been doing so far with the committee?
Sasun Steinbeck: don't be too sure Skylarian :)
Molly Montale: the list of committee members is as good as anyone could ever hope for (IMHO)
Peoney Feld: Sasun, in general, how will it all work?
Elise Benusconi: I'm just hoping to get some perspective on the committee's focus.
White Hyacinth: It looks like LL is very interested in "The Arts" lately; maybe they see a business opportunity?
Sasun Steinbeck: we have been debating all kinds of ways to help the art community and some type of endowment is in the mix too. Whether that becomes a reality, who knows
Peoney Feld: individual artists?
Maggi Mint: exactly who or what will benefit from the "endowment", RL art organizations? RL aritsits? what are the parameters?
Lizzo Dreamscape: my question too, Peony.
Skylarian Isachenko: Well, I suspect they are looking to gain more large entities entering sl just as they did with education
FreeWee Ling: How was the committee decided? I don;t disagree with the choices, just the process?
Sasun Steinbeck: Elise, so far it's been mostly meetings - we have so many issues to discuss. At this point in time we've finally solidified our high-level goals that you've seen in that post
Sasun Steinbeck: we have a lot of discussion to do to organize the art shows and really figure out what other projects we will be starting up to get those goals accomplished
Eliza Wierwight: In what way , subsidizing tiers ?
Zachh Cale: Thanks Sasun for pointing out this new blogpost - do you know yet how LL specifically plans to not compete with existing galleries? A lot of us have been paying to help present art content for SL, so I believe many of us are wondering how it could not compete, especially since SL owns the servers and the website promotion channels?
Sasun Steinbeck: Maggi that is under discussion, all of the above is being considered
Sasun Steinbeck: and let me clarify
Sasun Steinbeck: it's not specifically "RL" artists - but virtual art is what we are all about
Skylarian Isachenko: I would not mind seeing the linden homes be allowed to be a gallery
Lizzo Dreamscape: cool.
Sasun Steinbeck: Second Life art, specficially :)
Skylarian Isachenko: yes, but we are all real artists I hope
Sasun Steinbeck: which includes the idea that SL is a great place to exhibit and display RL art, too
Sasun Steinbeck: we are not shutting out 2D artists, in other words
Skylarian Isachenko: just because its virtual it should still be Real
Sasun Steinbeck: it's all real to us :)
Sasun Steinbeck: I'm getting behind on questions so bear with me
Skylarian Isachenko: You should be able to buy an RL print of the art for instance
Peoney Feld: people do that already, Sky
Sasun Steinbeck: White, my personal take on the business aspect is that LL sees this as another thing to bring new residents in, having a thriving creative art community is good for LL too
Sasun Steinbeck: but they really haven't given us any specific business reason why they are doing this
Peoney Feld: talk to Filthy Fluno for example, Sky
Peoney Feld: thanks, Sasun
Lizzo Dreamscape: idk why we have more artists. Let's have more artists!
Skylarian Isachenko: I know they do, I do it myself,
Sasun Steinbeck: FreeWee, I don't know what the committee criteria was... I'm hoping that LL gives the existing committee members some part of the process when we inevitably have to replace someone on the committee - not sure how that is going to work at this time
Skylarian Isachenko: but, LL could make it possible to buy a print through xstreet for instance and do the shipping and handling
FreeWee Ling: ty
Sasun Steinbeck: Zachh, regarding the competition issue - that is a common concern
Sasun Steinbeck: One thing that we will be thinking about a lot is how best to help the big art sims already in existance
Sasun Steinbeck: they have been around a lot longer than the LEA! They know "how it's done" and how to be successful
Ally Aeon: that would be nice
Sasun Steinbeck: so we want to support them "where they are" in some way. how we do that hasn't been discussed very much so I don't really know at this point
Sasun Steinbeck: I'd love to hear what you think would be the best way to support those types of big art galleries and art sims
Chloe Mineff: I am curious about having several sims packed with artwork, wouldnt this be a bit overwhelming?
Tia Macbain: well the NEA offers support and funding for projects exhibiting artistic excellence...they offer support
Skylarian Isachenko: Well if your going to hold large events, and use large sims in a similar manner to LL events, wont the galleries and artists get a bit lost, I mean people can get overwhelmed pretty fast.
Chloe Mineff: ao how are they landscaping/building it out?
Skylarian Isachenko: GM and all that
Maggi Mint: tier allotment, tier grants would be a nice way to support a gallery
Tia Macbain: not neccessarily own a mega gallery
Sasun Steinbeck: The LEA complex is not going to be 70 sims when it opens, contrary to what you may have heard, it will start off with maybe 5-6 sims, so considiering the huge number of existing galleries, it won't be *that* huge an addition to the mix
Lizzo Dreamscape: But the NEA also excercises Censorship.
Peoney Feld: hmkmm
Ally Aeon: I bleieve there is a lot of good in place such as your Gallery Tour system Sasun aslo the artist Guild group and the Gallery Owner gorup I consider to be something that helps a lot. So maybe it could be build on that.
Peoney Feld: yes, what about that?
Peoney Feld: censorship
Tia Macbain: sure lizzo...but if you think we arent censored to any degree now...
Lizzo Dreamscape: Just a comment....
Sasun Steinbeck: Yes Ally I definitely want to leverage what we already have in terms of the gallery list and tour hud
Zachh Cale: Thanks Sasun - I think one way would be to have a similar application process as was explained for artists to the LEA - gallery owners could apply to LL to have their tier waived?
Tia Macbain: and it is just a RL example of what the LEA could branch out to be
Lizzo Dreamscape: I agree with supporting Sasun's system. It ROCKS!
Maggi Mint: tier allotment, tier grants would be a nice way to support a gallery or providing space for artists would help a lot
Sasun Steinbeck: one thing that we all agree on is that there must be a really great, very useful - easy to use nexus where we can send people to YOUR galleries from the LEA complex
Skylarian Isachenko: There are always some limits to what you can display, just as society sets limits on anything
Molly Montale: could there ever be a repeat of the Burning Life "nipplegate" from a couple of years ago?
FreeWee Ling: So if there's an established gallery on a private sim, will there be any support for that? Or will the big guys have a competitive advantage?
Sasun Steinbeck: yes Zachh if we can get something like that approved, we'd definiteyl have some kind of application process
Elise Benusconi: It is hard to see how setting up additional real estate is going to be as effective as supporting the current system. That said, I am sure that an announcement that LL will underwrite "art" sims would result in a new glut of "galleries" suddently opening.
Skylarian Isachenko: WEll, you need a walk through portal that just takes you there without all this map teleport business
Zachh Cale: Sasun, that would be GREAT, because then many of us could easily maintain the cost of events more
Sasun Steinbeck: haha Molly, great question actually. We will be discussing if/how we will support art that may fall into the "adult" category
Tricia Aferdita nods
Doran Forzane: Sensorship of art, will possibly be one of LEA's biggest issues, LL may need to have a Mature or Adult sim as part of LEA
Peoney Feld: There should be anohter category for art....not adult,
Peoney Feld: Artistic freedom and license is essential for
Skylarian Isachenko: Non sexual nudes should not be adult
Skylarian Isachenko: Mature, yes, but not adult
Peoney Feld: real creativity
Lizzo Dreamscape: oooo.. interesting Peony.
Sasun Steinbeck: and I'm *sure* we will be discussing suitability of all the Mature art (artistic nudes, etc.) that will undoubtably show up on the sims
Peoney Feld: sexual nudes should not be adult if it is art
Peoney Feld: my goodness
Sasun Steinbeck: we really really really really do not want to get into the censorship game
Peoney Feld: do museums censor
Carly Frequency: one possibilty would be for LL to treat art groups as nonprofits for tier discounts -- without us having to incorporate in RL - the larger art sims, at least
Peoney Feld: art for children?
Doran Forzane: however in the TOS and standards LL do have a vague clause that could be used to get around their rating policy
Tia Macbain: i think the idea of a mega gallery is a form of competitiveness
Tia Macbain: and not really useful
Ally Aeon: yes I think LL should define where they drwa the line what is mature or adult art
FreeWee Ling: They going to ban megaprims?
Sasun Steinbeck: I agree P eoney, I'm speaking specifically of the LL adult guidelines, not the popular definition
Maggi Mint: any thing considered for a grant should be all original, copyright owned work...not knock offs of other pples art or imports of encyclopedia art
Peoney Feld: yes, but maybe there can be an art category
Skylarian Isachenko: I hae a terrible time with large stores rezing all the images, I can just imagine the night mare of a very large collection of art
Peoney Feld: that embraces everything
Sasun Steinbeck: hm not sure FreeWee, I'll have to ask about that
Maggi Mint: any thing considered for a grant should be all original, copyright owned work...not knock offs of other pples art or imports of encyclopedia ar
Sasun Steinbeck: we are going to be very hard core about copyright, don't worry about that
Lizzo Dreamscape: Good Maggi.
Tricia Aferdita: what would be nice is if it were perhaps a source of annex galleries for existing galleries within SL... a central hub in general that was almost like a walk through version of Sasun's HUD
Ghosty Kips: I think the term we need to focus on, instead of the confusing "adult" or "mature", is "erotic art". This is where I think LL is going to draw a line, and call it what they will
Peoney Feld: I have been looking at nudes in books and in paintings since I was a child...
Peoney Feld: museums, too
Peoney Feld: nude paintings
Sasun Steinbeck: yes Ghosty it will be interesting to see what happens :)
Peoney Feld: how do you think I got to be interesetd in art?
Skylarian Isachenko: your also dealing with an international situation, but US law applies
Peoney Feld: and learned early
Lizzo Dreamscape: hahaha!!
Soundsmith Kamachi: I would fidn it more intersting that such an art sim provides a short presentation of existing galleries, e.g. with tp point, short description
Peoney Feld: got good influences
FreeWee Ling: I think a fundamental question is who much autonomy with the board have? Will they get to decide what's art and whether to allow megaprim? Or is LL going to have final say?
Tia Macbain: I agree Soundsimith
Soundsmith Kamachi: instead of being soemthing taht becoemsa competition
Tia Macbain: now THAT is useful
Peoney Feld: learned anatomy before high school
Lizzo Dreamscape: I am with you, FreeWee.
Carly Frequency: I agree with Soundsmith as well
Sasun Steinbeck: yes Soundsmith that will be something I will push for very hard is some kind of innovative cool way to educate visitors about all the great existing galleries in SL and some easy way for them to launch over to them from the LEA
Carly Frequency: a portal to the art experience in SL
Sasun Steinbeck: we do NOT want to suck people from existing galleries to the LEA, on the contrary, that's where people will go to find out what the heck this art in SL thing is all about and we want to send them out to explore your places too!
Skylarian Isachenko: Well, in my world Peoney, you would likely be in a very bad space by now then, I live in a very conservative area
Sasun Steinbeck: The LEA sims are ideal for a big semi-annual art festival, too
Em Larsson: How will you decide who you send people to?
FreeWee Ling: I think the people in this room trust the board a lot more than they trust LL.
Em Larsson: anyone who wants to receive people, or will you choose?
Sasun Steinbeck: sort of another big art event to add to the mix of existing artistic/creative events like SL7B and BL
Zachh Cale: Does the Destination Guide currently do that on the website? Or are you talking about inworld only?
Peoney Feld: thank goodness I grew up where I did, in a house filled with culture ;)
Sacha Swindlehurst doubts linden has the faintest clue about art
Sasun Steinbeck: good question Em, we need to figure that out
Sasun Steinbeck: we have a good start with my gallery list, but that's certainly not an exhaustive list of every gallery in SL
Skylarian Isachenko: SLB and BL are themed, we do not really have much freedom
Skylarian Isachenko: its a challenge rather than creative freedom
Sasun Steinbeck: yes true Sky, the LEA events will be much more open in that regard
Skylarian Isachenko: nods
Sasun Steinbeck: we may have smaller themed events, who knows
Ghosty Kips: I'd like to see artists put SOME of their art in this central exhibit, with landmarks and so forth to draw people from this big draw to our indivitual galleries. At the same time, we should be able to promote our own entries at this big exhibit, and people can be free to "art walk" around to other artists after arriving
Sasun Steinbeck: all yet to be determined :)
FreeWee Ling: Hopefully more like NPIRL.
Chloe Mineff: SL is an adult place.. children shouldn't be here in the first place. but ther are conservatives who need to be considered.
Maggi Mint: One way to encourage both art and premium accounts ownership might be to alot (2) 512 tier free (a 1024) to anyone who buys a premium account and puts up an at gallery, of original art
Sasun Steinbeck: yes absolutely Ghosty, thanks for that
Skylarian Isachenko: well, we do have the ability to have slide show prims so we can show a lot of art with a few prims
Sasun Steinbeck: hm interesting, I'd love to see something like that Maggi
Nima Benoir: Now that's a great idea Maggi!
Sasun Steinbeck: sorry if I skipped over anyone's question! If you'd like an answer please paste it again for me
Ghosty Kips: and a free 512 on top of tier wouldnt hurt :o)
Skylarian Isachenko: And make them prove it original art too
Sasun Steinbeck: too much chat lol :)
White Hyacinth: I think LL waiving tier in any form is unlikely to happen
Skylarian Isachenko: which means they will have to show who they are in RL
Em Larsson: so the idea is to encourage more art, or more people viewing the art that is here?
Sasun Steinbeck: yes we will be very strict about the original art requirement
Lizzo Dreamscape: I hope machinima will be included.
Sasun Steinbeck: the very last thing we want is stolen art shown at the LEA, omg.
Soundsmith Kamachi: i was curious about the definition of art - veyr tricky one
Em Larsson: indeed!
Sasun Steinbeck: machinima most definitely!
Sasun Steinbeck: we have some well known machinematographers on the LEA
Molly Montale: the live music folks are hoping to be included
Elise Benusconi: Any effort LL would make to underwrite tier costs will open up a whole world of abuse by those who wish to have the land and no interest in supporting the arts. So it is something they are unlikely to undertake.
Eliza Wierwight: I'd be wary of people trying to acquire 'free'tiers using the Gallery premise as a foothold , tricky times , especially if that's intended to lure people Inworld
Sasun Steinbeck: yes definitely Molly, that's part of the plan!
Tia Macbain: you sure this isnt a way to control content and to find a way to control copyrights
Tia Macbain: juss askin.
Sasun Steinbeck: we don't know how that will look, but SL musicians will be part of the mix
Zowie Zane is Offline
Peoney Feld: no one can control your copyrights in your artwork
Elise Benusconi: I would much rather see LL take a proactive approach to introducing current and new residents to all the art that is already here.
Peoney Feld: unless you sell them or license them
Sasun Steinbeck: yes Elise and Eliza that's good feedbak
Peoney Feld: I agree, Elise
Skylarian Isachenko: Control in here is much less a concern than what they are doing in various legeslatures in rl
Em Larsson: I agree.. bring people to see what exists.. those of us who have been doing it already for a long time out of love.
Elise Benusconi: Perhaps distributing the gallery tour to all residents or at least offering it.
Sasun Steinbeck: we would most likely have some kind of application process so that the committee can evaluate each grant (if that comes to pass) on the merits of the art
White Hyacinth: So the LEA as a pointer to good stuff in-world seems to be the best way to go
Sasun Steinbeck: yes Em good point, and we want to support you guys that have been doing it for Sasun Steinbeck: if you have any ideas on how we can ... let me know :)
the love of it for all this time
Maggi Mint: anybody can figure out a way to abuse any system Elsie, if that is your criteria for determining how to proceed, then you will stop dead in your tracks at every turn
Van Caerndow: I love filling out grant forms
Peoney Feld: you know, you dont want to become so sophisticated as to discourage new artists in SL
Doran Forzane: Peoney, actually, if you dont hold a copyright of your artwork before you bring it into SL. Then LL place a copyright on it
Elise Benusconi: Offering an at tutorial at gateway communities...perhaps offering an "art buddy" to help show a new resident around, or at least offering a strong understanding of how to find and participate in the art world here.
Molly Montale: megaprims?
Lizzo Dreamscape: Good Em.
FreeWee Ling: The artists in SL are pushing what can be done with the technology. LL loves that. It's good PR and they learn what their product can and can't do. That's their motivation. We're all beta tester in technology and running businesses off creative work.
Ghosty Kips: well, i can say that, if LL is hoping to use art as a way to being people back to SL, then it's a good thing. it's where we shoud have been headed a year or two ago
Petal Fairlock: good idea elise!
Skylarian Isachenko: I have over a thousand RL works of original art, But I prefer a more intimate gallery, not that fond of huge builds
Peoney Feld: your original artwork is protected by common law
Peoney Feld: if you register it in DC
Sasun Steinbeck: yes true, part of the plan Peoney is to educate residents all about SL art, so we want to have a really cool experience for someone new to SL that happens to be an artist, how they might get plugged in.
Peoney Feld: that is an additional protection
Peoney Feld: important, for diff readons
Peoney Feld: but no one can taake it from you
Peoney Feld: yes, help them get started
Em Larsson: Are you saying we don't own ourart unless Washington says we do? Does Washington allow foreigners to register it?
Sacha Swindlehurst: elaborate doran?
quadrapop Lane: and the non-artists - new folks love the art sims I send em too - over the real estate and "malls"
Sasun Steinbeck: Skylarian, that's a good point, I know sometimes when I go to a huge art complex I get a bit overwhelmed. I'd love to hear any ideas on how we can have a huge art complex but not just completely overwhelm people with it
Peoney Feld: I have seen the number of artists burgeoning..people get lost in the shuffle
Peoney Feld: no Em
Tia Macbain: dont have huge complex...:)
Skylarian Isachenko: Make wiki with the art on it, thats how
quadrapop Lane: make it searchable
Sasun Steinbeck: yes we need to think about how we can make it fun and easy for someone new
Elise Benusconi: How about some out of world PR on behalf of SL artists?
Peoney Feld: I am saying when you create a drawing, eg., you own the copyrights to it automaticallyl
Skylarian Isachenko: give them Out world access to view the art without the overhead of SL
Sasun Steinbeck: hm interesting idea Elise
Em Larsson: no?
quadrapop Lane: have a really good tp or info system
Em Larsson: oh oh
Em Larsson: I see
Peoney Feld: if you want the protection of the federal coprytight low, then register it
Doran Forzane: There are some terms used in the TOS that I hope LEA are going to suggest with LL that need to be changed
Skylarian Isachenko: I send lots of folk to my web galleries
Sasun Steinbeck: maybe what we could do is pull together some info on copyright protection as it pertains to SL art/artists
Peoney Feld: dont let anyone talk you out of what you own
Sasun Steinbeck: I know that's a super confusing subject
Maggi Mint: registering with washington is just EXTRA protection, you establish a copyright by adding the notice to your work
Em Larsson: no for sure
Nima Benoir: You mean like an online art gallery Elise?
Doran Forzane: Sasun and I have spoken about them, its for another time
Elise Benusconi: I don't wish to seem self-serving, but I am currently setting up an art commerce website, and I am happy to open it to SL artists with RL art to sell...and will happily identify the art by SL names, etc.
Peoney Feld: well, it's more troublesome since many countries do not pay attentin to US copyright laws
Zachh Cale: What about having an application process for existing galleries to reside on SL funded sims? Many are already showing great art....
Elise Benusconi: Yes, Nima..I am starting an online gallery/sales site.
Doran Forzane: you can digimarc your art though and it is retained in SL as long as your image is noless than 256x256
sandhya2 Patel: that is wonderful
Sasun Steinbeck: Doran that's a good suggestion, we are going to get clear permission from everyone showing art at the LEA, nothing will be shown without permission, at least
Ghosty Kips: one ideawould be to separate by types of art. inworld sculpture, rl painting, digital, music, whathave you. instead of having everything in one place, if we have 5-6 sims, lets use those sims for different types of art so artists can focus on the niche markets that like their style or medium of works.
Molly Montale: It would be cool if the LEA sims have their own blog for pictures and news
Skylarian Isachenko: Deviant Art for instance is useful and free resource that you can make a gallery for your work and use in conjuction wiht SL to sell your work
Poid Mahovlich is Offline
Lizzo Dreamscape: From what I have heard so far... why not concentrate first and foremost on a Central Area that expands on what Sasun has done. And we can all participate in creating a Central location that serves as a place for revolving exhibits of all kinds.
Elise Benusconi: Yes, Deviant Art is excellent.
Sasun Steinbeck: yes Ghosty, good idea. we could slice and dice the categories in a lot of different ways
Sasun Steinbeck: Yes Molly we want that too!
Peoney Feld: a good thing for the NEA to work on is finding a way for original art not to be photographed, some kind of tech filter
Ally Aeon: How about LL allows for its residents to show their gallery and art id they are in that field on the SL website
Skylarian Isachenko: Digimarc gets very expensive
Sasun Steinbeck: what if we had a whole web page for the LEA? with a blog and other cool stuff. educational materials, introductory stuff, etc.?
Sasun Steinbeck: a web page on secondlife.com?
Skylarian Isachenko: and links to artists websites
Eliza Wierwight: I'm not keen on that idea of categorisation at all for myself , not a bit
Elise Benusconi: That sounds like a great idea, Sasun! :-)
FreeWee Ling: I don't like categories. Causes segmentation. Separation. Segregation.
quadrapop Lane: what if your art is 3d and sl only? how do you advertise outside of sl?
Peoney Feld: I presume that LL is not going to want a cut of art
Peoney Feld: proceeds
Em Larsson: Sounds good Sasun
Skylarian Isachenko: take a phtoos and put it up like any woark
quadrapop Lane: take photos? doesn't do much of thatr stuff justice
Sasun Steinbeck: yes quad it could be a mine field and there's more than one way to categorize
Skylarian Isachenko: same thinig with a sculpture
Skylarian Isachenko: photo graph it
Elise Benusconi: Video, Quadrapop.
Callipygian Christensen: I'd never assume that Peoney lol
Elise Benusconi: ScreenFlow is a great, free tool you can use.
Peoney Feld: I dont assume it
Peoney Feld: lol
Skylarian Isachenko: short video clips are also a good thought
Maya Paris: web page sounds like a great idea Sasun
Sasun Steinbeck: one thing I wanted to point out and get feedback on is this whole concept of "archiving" art
Peoney Feld: I hope that they are not
Sasun Steinbeck: we want to SAVE all this cool stuff
Ally Aeon: soem of us use the profile we have in sl already to show what we do in sl, and I think it would be super if there woudl be something like that on the SL webside
Sasun Steinbeck: things in SL can be so ephemeral
Sasun Steinbeck: here today, gone tomorrow
Sasun Steinbeck: how can we save a record of all this cool art?
FreeWee Ling: The archive is critical. I think that's the most important job of this plan.
quadrapop Lane: video might but really think odf some of the more immersive and interactive art that can only exist and be experienced in sl - that is the kind of thing that needs to be preserved by LL and LEA is perfect for that
Peoney Feld: well, that needs permission, too
Sasun Steinbeck: the current fuzzy plan is to have a special Linden account (I vote for "Art Linden" LOL)
Zachh Cale: Sasun, I think that's an excellent point - I would love to see your committee working on that first - so many things are disappearing now
Ghosty Kips: i have no issue with their archiving art, so long as our rights and copyrights are protected. we as artists should have FULL control over the content even after it's archived.
Sasun Steinbeck: that can accept donations of art
Peoney Feld: hmmm
Sasun Steinbeck: for archival purposes
Peoney Feld: very interesting Sasun
Sasun Steinbeck: we really haven't discussed it much, so we need ideas
White Hyacinth: Similar to the time capsule?
FreeWee Ling: LIke a museum
Elise Benusconi: Wayback Machine for SL....
Sasun Steinbeck: perhaps Art Linden can whip out some of those exhibits... perhaps even full sims! for future shows maybe
Sasun Steinbeck: yeah a wayback machine :)
Skylarian Isachenko: Is Art LInden still a LInden?
Sasun Steinbeck: they can take a snapshot of an entire sim... like a rollback, right?
Skylarian Isachenko: they lost so many of them
Zachh Cale: I think if that is the main function of the LEA, archival, then SL gets it's own mega gallery, and it doesn't compete with existing galleries
Peoney Feld: well, if LL makes use of archived art for commercial purposes, the artist shoud be compensated
Sasun Steinbeck: was there an Art Linden?
Sasun Steinbeck: haha I don't remember
Zachh Cale: there are TONS of exciting exhibits that many STILL have not seen
Elise Benusconi: Like rezboxes....click and everthing stored falls back into place.
Zachh Cale: and they are disappearing
Sasun Steinbeck: Peoney at this time I believe the current plan is for donations only
Skylarian Isachenko: We lost most of those we have worked with in the past, so I dont know
Sasun Steinbeck: but that's a really good point
Peoney Feld: kk
Skylarian Isachenko: Cost a lot of money to maintain these sims
Lizzo Dreamscape: yes! and private corporations like IBM have sponsored AMAZING things... where do they fit?
Sasun Steinbeck: yeah we don't want those amazing sims you've seen vanish forever
Tia Macbain: not if they are linden sims
Peoney Feld: I just want LL to treat art as the valuable thing it is.....
Maggi Mint: good point peony ----[15:36] Peoney Feld: I presume that LL is not going to want a cut of art --- is this "grant" really going to be jus a way for LL to increase THEIR income, like Xstreet became?
Peoney Feld: and it is worth money
Skylarian Isachenko: A lot of the corporates are going behind firewalls and not doing as much as they used to
Ghosty Kips: well, big companies like IBM can fork up their own sims if they like :)
Sasun Steinbeck: since land is one thing we will have plenty of, one thing I hope we can do is a lot of whole-sim art installations
Lizzo Dreamscape: No, Ghostly. I don't agree. They should be valued too.
Peoney Feld: I think artists should get free space somehow
Zachh Cale: Yes! Archiving so many full sim installations would be a huge service to the sl community
Peoney Feld: if there is so much darned space..
Sasun Steinbeck: Yes Peoney, we will be giving out lots of free space for artists to exhibit on the LEA sims
Peoney Feld: yay
Peoney Feld: lol
Em Larsson: Wow
Sasun Steinbeck: and we will grow beyond the initial 5-6-ish sims if needed
Skylarian Isachenko: Well, each sim is another processor and there is a limit there
Skylarian Isachenko: Archiving entire sims is going to take serious resources
Doran Forzane: big companies like IBM are actually not in aliance with Linden Labs anymore. That went sour
Chloe Mineff: Sasun did anyone address Peopny's comment? [15:36] Peoney Feld: a good thing for the NEA to work on is finding a way for original art not to be photographed, some kind of tech filter
Em Larsson: did it?
Callipygian Christensen: my question too quad,,if SL would let me stay on the grid to ask it lol
Ghosty Kips: that would be excellent, esp for us 2D artists
Sasun Steinbeck: ok that is some great feedback thank you Peoney, I agree that would be great
Chloe Mineff: taht is crucial to thwart stealing.
Skylarian Isachenko: That is pretty much impossible, in order to view it, you can capture it
Em Larsson: I like Peony's idea
Skylarian Isachenko: Nature of the beast
quadrapop Lane: ty sasun
Peoney Feld: I wonder if technicallly, there is some way to do it Sasun
Em Larsson: Even if they could, would it stay with art after it has been sold?
Sasun Steinbeck: technical solutions tend to be the least effective though... for each scheme you come up with, someone cracks it
Peoney Feld: maybe LL could work on it
Elise Benusconi: Why couldn't the ability to photograph be a permission that can be turned on and off by estate management controls?
Doran Forzane: you can do that in the estate convenant, its the only place you can stop the photography of art on a sim
Elise Benusconi: Someone really determined could still do a print-screen, but that wouldn't be most people.
Skylarian Isachenko: you can always screen cap
Zachh Cale: Well you can take screenshots of anything
Skylarian Isachenko: you cannot stop that
quadrapop Lane: cos sl snapshots are screen shots lol
Sasun Steinbeck: so don't hold your breath :) BUT if there is some very good way that could stop the vast majority, that's something we can lean on LL to provide for the art community
Em Larsson: But then, if you sold a work.. and it were displayed somewhere else....
Chloe Mineff: yes liek some web sites like snopes disallow copy and paste
Skylarian Isachenko: you can still cap them,
Sasun Steinbeck: interesting idea, I wonder if there is a jira for that type of snapshot permission already?
Skylarian Isachenko: once its in your video merory you can manipulate it
Maggi Mint: watermark your art if you are afraid someone will photograph it
White Hyacinth: You may have noticed it is impossible to screen capture Windows media player. These things can be enforced (and I hate that ;) )
Sasun Steinbeck: seems like there are some tough challenges to make that work
Peoney Feld: by the way, anything I said about copyright should not be construed as my discouraging anyone from registering in DC
Sasun Steinbeck: like being a sim away and zooming in for a snap :)
Peoney Feld: on the contrary
Skylarian Isachenko: I have never had a problem capturing anything at all on my screen
Doran Forzane: best solution to protect against snapshots is digimarc, you should all be using digimarc for your art
Skylarian Isachenko: Thats fine if you have a lot of money to spend
Peoney Feld: would like to know more about that, Doran
Sasun Steinbeck: hm if there is something we can do on the LEA sims to discourage any kind of theft... be it snaps or whatnot... I'd be all for that
Skylarian Isachenko: it costs to use digimarc
Skylarian Isachenko: commercial service
Dragomir Greenwood: I have watermak strips over the art in my gallery. Doesn't affect the final purchased art
Em Larsson wonders what digimark is.
Sasun Steinbeck: hmmm I'll have eto google that later and educate myself on digimarc
Skylarian Isachenko: electronic signature
Doran Forzane: yes, but it is the only way to truely protect an digital version of any image
Em Larsson: me too
Skylarian Isachenko: embeded in the file
sandhya2 Patel: wonders how to do watermark strip
Sasun Steinbeck: I wonder if something like that coudl be supplied as a service on the LEA sims... or some kind of anti-theft technology if such a thingn exists. as long as it doesn't interfere with the enjoyment of the art...
Skylarian Isachenko: It can however be striped out with the right tools so its not fool proof
Callipygian Christensen: arriving late, did I miss information on how space in the sims is to be assigned?
Dragomir Greenwood: I have a png logo on a prim accross the art
Sasun Steinbeck: Hi Callipygian, haven't really talk about that, we don't really have a detailed plan how that is going to happen
Skylarian Isachenko: in reality the resolution of art in sl is so low its pretty useless for anything but in sl
Sasun Steinbeck: we do know there will be an application process for exhibit space on the LEA sims
Doran Forzane: There is no reason why LL couldnt own digimarc and when someone uploads a texture it applies a digimarc unique to the account uploading
Dragomir Greenwood: Thieves are lazy, the work it would take to remove is not worth their effort
Maya Paris: is copyright really the big issue here? i'd like to hear more about the LEA plans
Sasun Steinbeck: the committee will process those applications and decide yes/no based on the merits of the work
Sasun Steinbeck: other than that we don't know how it will be divided up
Zachh Cale: Sasun, do you know the business reason behind creating an SL mega gallery as opposed to supporting existing galleries ? Have you hear any discussion of that, or is that a new idea?
Doran Forzane: it would be a cost though to LL
Callipygian Christensen: ah,thanks Sasun - I realize those pushing the envelope of tech are vvery attractive to LL, but I hope there is also space for old fashioned 2d pretties too :)
Tia Macbain: good question Zachh
Lizzo Dreamscape: I love it when the artists put their names across their artwork on Xstreet... I use them for quickly made posters for their shows... hehe
Skylarian Isachenko: yes, considering there are hundreds of thousands of textures uploaded every day
Tia Macbain: [15:48] Zachh Cale: Sasun, do you know the business reason behind creating an SL mega gallery as opposed to supporting existing galleries ? Have you hear any discussion of that, or is that a new idea?
Maggi Mint: the resolution of the tiny artworks we have in here is so low as to make it imposible to reproduce in a RL format and that is where the biggest concern for theft would be
Sasun Steinbeck: Zachh we definitely want to do both, we want to support existing art sims/galleries and also have an art nexus, and a good starting point/place for someone interested in art in SL
Sasun Steinbeck: We want to promote art with o ur regular events too
Elise Benusconi: lol Lizzo
Sasun Steinbeck: including music, machinema, live performance art, etc.
Em Larsson: I wonder if you are not in the big gallery, will you just get pushed out?
Ghosty Kips: yes, id like to see the LL mega exhibit used to promote us and out own galleries, not the other way around
Tia Macbain: thats about everything I do on my sim now....guess I better think of somethng new
Doran Forzane: Thats an interesting one EM, something I have thought about
Sasun Steinbeck: Em we want to avoid that for sure, I don't think that 5-6 more sims is going to push anyone out of the arts at this point though
Em Larsson: Well, I wonder why LL is interested in art,
Zachh Cale: Does LL feel that existing galleries do not give new artists a chance? It sounds like LL will have an application process so they will be choosing artists as well....
Sasun Steinbeck: however we will probably grow, and we want to do it in a way that doesn't steal visitors from your galleries too
Em Larsson: OK.. I'm sure that is not YOUR intention. I didn't mean to imply that.
Sasun Steinbeck: as I mentioned we want to push them [visitors] OUT to all the cool places to see
Molly Montale: Desmond Shang raises an interesting point on the blog, that the LEA will create winners and losers from those who want to participate with many more losers than winners creating the possibility of hurt feelings and ill will
Em Larsson: I certainly believe you.
Doran Forzane: I would EM, I would shut Angel down. If it became a cost I couldnt bear anymore
Skylarian Isachenko: Hmmm Screenflow is for Macs.. useless to me., al well
Sasun Steinbeck: Molly that's a good point, but as it was raised by someone else... artists regularly get rejected for art shows, it's just a part of life. They can't expect a "yes" from everyone
Tia Macbain: i would turn tiatopia into a giant sandbox.
Carly Frequency: This is a different tack - but I'd ike to see the group reach out to RL art schools to come view our work as easily- reached galleries of diverse art for them to study - and encourage more artists to come here in that way, too
Sasun Steinbeck: we have lots of artists... some are going to be told no, it's inevitable
Lizzo Dreamscape: GREAT Carly.
Sasun Steinbeck: ooooo Carly. I really like that idea.
FreeWee Ling: Will private art-oriented sims be able to apply to move to an LEA sim? Or to be subsidized?
Sasun Steinbeck: that you very much
Elise Benusconi: Love that idea, Carly!
Sasun Steinbeck: FreeWee I hope we have some details on that soon!
Skylarian Isachenko: One thing we need desperately is an actually usable artists inventory system, one that does not take an entire day to try and sort through the art.
Zachh Cale: Well I don't understand the business reason for competing with existing galleries who pay LL to present content for SL - so why not just have the LEA be a permanent archive for all the wonderful exhibits that are rapidly disappearing from existing galleries and sims? Just an idea, don't mean to put you on the spot Sasun...
Sasun Steinbeck: we are discussing that, most definitely. Do you have any ideas other than a subsidy how we can best support art sims?
Doran Forzane: LEA will need a criteria, it will need a due diligence process like any RL gallery
Sasun Steinbeck: LOL Sky, as a collector myself, I agree
Elise Benusconi: By promoting them, Sasun....if it can't be cash, it should be reach.
Dragomir Greenwood: Give them sample galleries in the sim
Carly Frequency: advertising, Sas
Sasun Steinbeck: no Zachh, please put me on the spot :) that's great feedback
FreeWee Ling: Well, directing traffic helps, but the problem with maintaining a sim is the obscene cost.
Skylarian Isachenko: I happen to know a very large university director of virtual resources, I will speak with her about the idea of the college of art having a presence here in SL
Tricia Aferdita: this would be a good opportunity to show SL as more than a big sex game
Carly Frequency: LEA can have lots of posters and ads for original art - everywhere
Sasun Steinbeck: yes Doran, we'll have a defined process for sure, it won't be haphazard. it's all yet to be worked out though. Any ideas are welcome!
Zachh Cale: LOL Sasun I can't believe you are taking all this feedback - 60 avatars talking at once
Tricia Aferdita: which is probably more why they are doing it than anything
Tia Macbain: ok so the HUB Sasun....how will it work....is it more than the teleport system you supply us with now?
Tricia Aferdita: PR
Lizzo Dreamscape: Nice template for that (making a artist inventory system) is Bones Writers MUSIC sim... you can go to Blues Artists, Classical, individual aritists.....TRAX is the name
Zachh Cale: We need martinis after this for Sasun
Sasun Steinbeck: LOL :)
Em Larsson: I hope you are right Tricia
Skylarian Isachenko: We certainly need something, its insane trying to sort work
Sasun Steinbeck: yes I think it would be *awesome* to reach out to some RL art orgs
Doran Forzane: Zach, thats way you save it and read it back
Doran Forzane: lol
sandhya2 Patel: Can art and sculpture go on sl protected land?
Tia Macbain: because a HUB can be something that is barely visible....or extremely visible
Elise Benusconi: lol Here, here! Cheers to Sasun for letting us ask all the tough questions! :-)
Sasun Steinbeck: I'm putting that one high on my list of things to discuss :)
Lizzo Dreamscape: Poor Sasun! Glad she doesn't own BP too!!
Zachh Cale: :))
Em Larsson: LOL
Zachh Cale: lmao
Carly Frequency: hell - I wish she DID own BP
Sasun Steinbeck: LOL!
Ghosty Kips: well, to be honest, i wouldnt mind a percentage of my art sales going to help suupport a sim or a series of sims that benefit the community. but the community needs to draw equal or benefit from the sims, and not just the artists that are showcased there.
Elise Benusconi: lol
Tia Macbain: so if the idea is for the LEA to build a gallery then to build a hub....why cant it be to build a HUB THEN to build a gallery
Sasun Steinbeck: yes we are all in agreement that art can and will be for sale on the LEA sims
Carly Frequency: yes Tia
Skylarian Isachenko: LL would be using our work to promote their product so it sonly fair they foot the bills
Sasun Steinbeck: we want to support the arts, and that's going to help a lot of artists
sandhya2 Patel: i was asking if sl protected land could be a way of showing off some sculpture and art in sl
White Hyacinth: I think LEA can be wonderful for the arts in SL -- if it can promote art based on its quality; not the highest bidder; not the loudest mouth
Em Larsson: I agree with Skylarian
Eliza Wierwight: ditto
Tia Macbain: IF this is the LEA and an endowment of current programs...then support the current programs first....wouldnt need more than a 1/4 sim to do that
Sasun Steinbeck: yes right White, and as you can see from the list of committee members, we have some very good people in the group
Tia Macbain: tto have ANOTHER gallery that is HUGE isnt going to help us
Sasun Steinbeck: we will be making judgements based on the merits, not political or whatever
Em Larsson: hard to do, Sasun
Elise Benusconi: You know a tremendous opportunity is currently being wasted in the Linden Homes sims....why not have identified SL art on display...show people what is possible...int he little public squares and neighborhood hubs.
Doran Forzane: yes, its a good group, shame its missing one or 2 though.
Sasun Steinbeck: oooo Elise
Sasun Steinbeck: very interesting
Ghosty Kips: this is true, there's tons, literally tons of linden land that nothing is ever done with. i used to live across from four sims that are, and always have been, empty save for a few trees and a path
Tia Macbain: so if the LEA supports first I can see the validity of that
Elise Benusconi: So all public Linden places. Makes sense...they all need life anyway.
Sasun Steinbeck: yeah land is one thing we have plenty of :) it's the other stuff that may be difficult to get
FreeWee Ling: I have a residential sim whose residents support galleries and a music venue and no one makes a dime off it. It's a serious challenge to meet the basic cost of the thing. If we could be considered a not-for-profit artists community, that could go far to ensure its survival.
Tia Macbain: if it builds a mega gallery...sandbox time for me
Skylarian Isachenko: Yes, exactly, as I had mentioned, It would be great if we could put our art in thos homes as galleries instead of wasted spaces
Sasun Steinbeck: we definitely want to provide some real support to those types of sims FreeWee
quadrapop Lane: as LL build an art collection use it to "decorate" as in public art - at events like sl7b, around the LL entry areas etc
Carly Frequency: yes Free Wee that was my point earlier - to be considered as nonprofits for discounted tiers
Em Larsson: yes, like an art bank
FreeWee Ling: Yes. :)
Tia Macbain: and as far as full sim events....there are sims and sim owners that already do that
sandhya2 Patel: yes like statues in cities
quadrapop Lane: and not just texture on a prin and simple rl sculpture analogs but real SL interactive - showcase the best sl art can be
sandhya2 Patel: they are there for all to enjoy
Zachh Cale: Free, that would at least be something in support of existing galleries!
Tia Macbain: so I wonder if there is a way to support and enhance ...rather than compete
Maggi Mint: getting LL could look at getting grants from RL art organizations, like the Mcnight foundaton, to help fund the arts in SL, that way they could, in turn, help defray costs to SL artist (in the form of land tier) and still not hack away at their own bottom line to do it
Skylarian Isachenko: There needs to be a back up system too so when an artist leaves and their account expires all the texturees fo their art do nto go poof too
Sasun Steinbeck: yes true Tia and we don't want to steal any visitors from the already existing sims
Skylarian Isachenko: which they eventually will
Sasun Steinbeck: oh intersting Maggi, I love that idea
Sasun Steinbeck: thank you
Tia Macbain: I think the Hub Sasun is wonderful idea
Elise Benusconi: ALSO...how about requiring all official Gateway communities to offer public spaces that feature single pieces of art...never enough to threaten real galleries...but introduce the idea to residents...LL could donate the land to the Gateway communities.
Tia Macbain: I am not too keen on the mega gallery...as being a first act for the LEA....juss sayin
Molly Montale: Will Moles be involved in developing infrastucture?
Doran Forzane: Skylarian, provided that is the artists wish, the content owners wish must be respected
Sasun Steinbeck: one of my HUGE interests in this project is the art HUB - how do we educate people on the existing places to go, how can we make it super easy to send them, and fun to use?
Tia Macbain: Then that I can support
Em Larsson: I agree with Tia
Tia Macbain: if that is your first priority
Em Larsson: Same here
Ghosty Kips: i like the mega gallery idea - IF its a tool for promoting us and out own galleries, not as an end to itself. the gallery should be a HUB in and of itself, really
Tia Macbain: yes ghosty
Sasun Steinbeck: good question Molly, I just asked that the other day. I don't know. I'll find out soon since I have a real interest in the architecture of the structures on the sims
Em Larsson: As a use of the Hub, I found it very difficult to find galleries.
Tia Macbain: but its all in the idea of the mission statement
Tia Macbain: is it to have a mega gallery or to have a hub
Sasun Steinbeck: yes Em I agree, really haven't seen a hub that I found really useful
Nima Benoir: I'm with Tia on this as well, the lea shouldn't start out as a competitive thing right off the bat
Tia Macbain: and THAT is the question...whoa hamlet reference
Sasun Steinbeck: I'd really like to make something that WORKs well
Zachh Cale: lol
Carly Frequency: perhaps a sample piece of art that contains a teleporter to the gallery - a whole hub of those would be a very cool intro - and a link TO that hub from every entry-point sim for newcomers
Lizzo Dreamscape: Em.. I think that's a good point.. but I would LOVE to see it expanded and made more comprehensive.
Maggi Mint: any kind of mega display would be tacky and overwhleming: art displays need to be done in "intimate", small scale settings
Tia Macbain: well if you want our support Sasun...particularly mine
Tia Macbain: the focus should be about support
Tia Macbain: not promotion
Sasun Steinbeck: good idea Carly thank you
Em Larsson: I agree Lizzo
Nima Benoir: Why not a focus on education about the art and artist of SL first?
Skylarian Isachenko: Dupilcate the art and the links on a website so you can slurl to the galleris from there
Doran Forzane: thats because those in Linden Labs who build dont know how to build....LOL
Doran Forzane: SO all the hubs looks like crap
Tia Macbain: as ppl trust the idea
Skylarian Isachenko: heck of alot faster to view and link to
Tia Macbain: the gallery or mega gallery could be a viable part
Ghosty Kips: well, if we consider deviding the sims up by type of art, wouldnt it make sense to have each sim / art type have it's own HUB/HUD thing?
Sasun Steinbeck: yes Maggi I tend to get overwhelemed when there is just SO much in visible range to absorb, good point
White Hyacinth: LEA might be like the front page of a blog: Small sample of art... [Click here to see the rest of it...]
Zachh Cale: I think the existing destination works amazingly well, would destination still exist for art as well?
quadrapop Lane: the size of the display area depends on the art involved.... come to uwa and see what I deakl with each month... everything from jewellery to mega prim pieces...
Sasun Steinbeck: yes Ghosty maybe that's the best idea... a hub of some kind on every sim?
Tia Macbain: but if it is in direct competition to say what I do for instance....then put on your running shoes....
Tia Macbain: lol
Carly Frequency: right - but the click is a teleport, White Hyacinth
Ghosty Kips: yes, dor the differnt types of art on each sim
Sasun Steinbeck: you mean the Destination Guide, Zachh?
Zachh Cale: yes Sasun :)
Sasun Steinbeck: we do have an art category in there...
Ghosty Kips: a digital hub, a painting hub, a sculpture hub, a music hub etc
Callipygian Christensen: Listeing booths for live musicians of some form would be nice..has that been mentioned?
Zachh Cale: Yes it works amazingly well
Zachh Cale: so many newbies use it
Tia Macbain: BINGO GHosty for the win
Sasun Steinbeck: maybe some type of cool integration with that... but the Guide doesn't try to be comprehensive and list every location known to man...
Ghosty Kips bows
Tia Macbain: maybe with SMALL SAMPLES
Tia Macbain: of artwork
Sasun Steinbeck: thank you Ghosty, good idea :)
Tia Macbain: right here
sandhya2 Patel: what about art that has interactive components to it
Sasun Steinbeck: hahahahah yes Tia :)
Lizzo Dreamscape: Zachh... I use it to find interesting Artists for my Gallery! You never KNOW what Gem you will find at the next click!!!
sandhya2 Patel: such as walk through sound etc?
Tricia Aferdita: I need to run to another meeting, but thank you for presenting this, Sasun. I look forward to receiving the transcript!
Sasun Steinbeck: I love interactive art :)
quadrapop Lane: and think opf HOPW this is being accessed onm the screen - dont sdee many of you using v2.0 but all the newbies do.... and how do they find their weay around?
Ghosty Kips: right, and each hub promotes the outside galleries in SL, and the artists promote their presense in the hub of their choosing
Nima Benoir: A way to support artists would be to add a catagory of self representing artist on the xstreet marketplace, like they have on ebay
Sasun Steinbeck: oh yes it's 4pm, if anyone needs to go, then thank you for attending and for your feedback! and if you have more - please IM any time!
Tia Macbain: but the minute LL or LEA competes with the ppl that feed its monitary engine....bad idea
Sasun Steinbeck: I'll be here for a while longer, so keep shouting :)
Sasun Steinbeck: LOL Lizzo :)
Em Larsson: I agree with Tia
Carly Frequency: Ghosty hit on something - if we artists could choose which category we wished to align with - it would not be some committee dictating
Maggi Mint: is there and LEA subscribomatic anywhere, where we could sign up to get inworld updates?
quadrapop Lane: WD sasun :)
Filthy Fluno: omg...what about a website that has slurls to all the galleries!
Elise Benusconi: I do have to run...thank you for all the info, Sasun! And, if anyone wishes to discuss placing their art on my website, please IM me! See you all soon! :-))
quadrapop Lane: lol
Skylarian Isachenko: yes, good diea,
Em Larsson: why they would think there is $$ in art, I have no idea.
Skylarian Isachenko: I mentioned that
Doran Forzane: Sasun, is LEA considering the impacts of irregular sculptured meshies when they are introduced. If your place a lot of art down with those polygons you will lag the sim up big time?
Nima Benoir: I'm with Em and Tia there are so many other ways that LL could support the arts that benefit us all
Sasun Steinbeck: right Carly, I think that is the current thinking too
Sasun Steinbeck: self-categorize
quadrapop Lane: isn't that what sasun's hud used to be?
Tia Macbain: I THINK the LEA needs a clear mission statement
Ghosty Kips: that wold be a great dea, a cental web site, with sections like the hubs inworld, with slurls to different exhibits in each hub/sim
Sasun Steinbeck: good question Doran, I don't know anything about meshes, but I'll bring that up
quadrapop Lane: mesh lag will be local client...
Tia Macbain: I wonder if THAT could be the first order of things
Filthy Fluno: oy vey
Doran Forzane: its one for galleries, its the maths behind how they work
Tia Macbain: so we know that it is a friendly organization and what the intentions are
quadrapop Lane: as with alpha and sculptuies now
Lizzo Dreamscape: Thanks for having me all you cool people! poofing.
Sasun Steinbeck: yes Nima and I'd love to hear your ideas, we're not all about just this big art complex
Ghosty Kips: I have to run too folks. plz make this transcript available somewhere?
Skylarian Isachenko: Maximum optimization to reduce any lag to a min.
Carly Frequency: bye Ghosty
Ghosty Kips: bye everyone, Namaste :)
Nima Benoir: Ciao!
Tia Macbain: Mission statements are the best thing to organize a plan...juss sayin
Katerina Burner: bye bye :)
Scotj Criss: bye everyone!! thanks for coming
Sasun Steinbeck: we have published our list of high-level goals, that's nto quite a mission statement, but you can get the feel for what we are all about from that
Sasun Steinbeck: yes Tia I agree
Tia Macbain: nods
Em Larsson: A mission statement at least sets a direction
Tia Macbain: I would think you would Sasun...but the LEA must...or it will feel like a hostile situation ....again...juss sayin
Sasun Steinbeck: I hope we can have our own website soon so we can have things like our mission/goals in one spot :)
Carly Frequency: Sas - thank you for your work on this - I feel like we are heard by the LEA with you there.
quadrapop Lane: ty :))
Molly Montale: This has been super, Sasun. I am curious had you been designated to present this or have you done this out of your own sense for transparency? :)
Doran Forzane: laughs
Sasun Steinbeck: yes Tia we dont' want to appear competitive, that's the last thing we want.
Sasun Steinbeck: I did it myself :)
Molly Montale: ah :)
Nima Benoir: I guess I'm a afraid that in the end it won't be art unless it's endorsed by the LEA the official organization of the arts now in SL
Tia Macbain: okies I takin mah 2 cents back to mah sim....seeya....thanks Sasun!
Sasun Steinbeck: I think you guys have a lot of good feedback
Scotj Criss: Thank you Sasun for a very informative hour
Doran Forzane: Nima, I wouldnt worry about that
Sasun Steinbeck: and I want to represent the gallery owners so that we don't accidentally trample you under while we do all this work :)
Carly Frequency: We don't trample easily
Sasun Steinbeck: LOL
Em Larsson: I really appreciate your taking the trouble Sasun
Eliza Wierwight: Thanks Sasun this is massive undertaking to wrangle , much appreciated
Sasun Steinbeck: my pleasure, thank you
Em Larsson: And all the work you do on our behalf generally
Sasun Steinbeck: I hope we can do more like this!
Zachh Cale: Thanks Sasun! What is the next step, will we hear back from you, will the committee respond to our feedback?
Em Larsson: I wonder if you have a sense of why LL is interested?
Sasun Steinbeck: One thing I should mention is that I will be gone for two months starting in July
Em Larsson: I understand why you are
Maya Paris: Thanks a lot Sasun:)
Em Larsson: and your group
Sasun Steinbeck: so I'll be taking a bit of haitus from... everything for a while :)
Nima Benoir: Thanks Sasun! At least we trust you!
Em Larsson: but LL? What is the source fo their interest?
Eliza Wierwight: an email from LL that my tiers are covered will suffice ~laughs~
Skylarian Isachenko: I believe it is because they are trying to bring in more large organizations
Sasun Steinbeck: but I'll be back and still in the LEA when I return, don't worry
Zachh Cale: YEAH Eliza!! hehe
Skylarian Isachenko: doing with art what they did with education
White Hyacinth: Yay Sasun
Molly Montale: its the Vulcan pan farr
Katerina Burner: thank you everyone for coming today
White Hyacinth claps
Soundsmith Kamachi: thanks for inviting, Sasun, and all the good info
Sasun Steinbeck: Hm you know they've never really said to anyone exactly why they are doing this
Eliza Wierwight: ~beams~ I'm practical !
Soundsmith Kamachi: bye everyone
Sasun Steinbeck: so all we can do is guess at this point :)
Tia Macbain: Em...we may never find out....but one this is....it must suit them to some degree or they wouldnt BE interested
Doran Forzane: 2 months of bliss
Em Larsson: Why does that worry me?
Sasun Steinbeck: bye and thanks for coming, those of you leaving :)
Em Larsson: How long will we miss you Sasuan?
Zachh Cale: wow Sasun! thanks for sharing that with us
Tia Macbain: okies bye
Sasun Steinbeck: 2 months I'll be gone
Skylarian Isachenko: They need the large level input in order to reinvent their coporate image
Sasun Steinbeck: bicycling around Europe :)
Eliza Wierwight: oh wow
Nima Benoir: Oh Wow! That's wonderful!
Carly Frequency: we'll try to hang on that long!
quadrapop Lane: have a great time in rl sasun :)
Molly Montale: wow :)
Skylarian Isachenko: they made a big mistake with the gamer image
Sasun Steinbeck: haha yeah hang in there, jeez. Don't all fall apart while I'm away :)
Molly Montale: post to flickr :)
Em Larsson: gamer image?
Eliza Wierwight: have a blast, what a fantastic adventure
quadrapop Lane: yeah take lotsa pics for us :)
Doran Forzane: Skylarian, its their bread and butter.
Skylarian Isachenko: Have a grand time Sasun, and may it be a fabulous adventure
Em Larsson: Wow... great treip Sasun
Em Larsson: Do you know when you're returning Sasun?
Skylarian Isachenko: Its not a game, and folk are learning that
Sasun Steinbeck: thanks! yes return date is not set but most likely September or late August
Doran Forzane: SL, is a MMO.... gaming is part of it. Its also a collaboration, its what each resident wants it to be
Maggi Mint: id there an inworld place to subcribe for updates on the LEA???????
Skylarian Isachenko: Hundreds of thousads are empty accounts
Em Larsson: ah, OK.. for the summer.. cool!
Sasun Steinbeck: good question Maggi
Doran Forzane: Its more the issue of how the outside world views SL that is the issue
Em Larsson: yes, how can we learn about what is happening?
Sasun Steinbeck: hm... the LL community blog at this point
Sasun Steinbeck: maybe someday the LEA will have our own web page/blog/feed
Sasun Steinbeck: I'm pushing for that!
Skylarian Isachenko: Actually its a platform where you might have games, but its not a game in itself
Em Larsson: You think the issue is imagine not $$ Forzan?
Molly Montale: yaay
FreeWee Ling: Who is Niko Linden. The Overlord of this project?
Sasun Steinbeck: He is the supreme overlord, yes
Eliza Wierwight: oh my
Sasun Steinbeck: :)
Eliza Wierwight: sounds kinky
Sasun Steinbeck: he's our primary contact with LL for this project
Sasun Steinbeck: we have met with other Lindens, including M
Sasun Steinbeck: they pop in at our regular meetings, but Niko is The Man as far as we are concerned
Molly Montale: LEA will not be effected by the recent Linden restructuring?
Em Larsson: I need to get the transcript so I understand the background and context
Maggi Mint: an inworld notification would be handy...I tend to avoid bloated bloggs
Doran Forzane: actually, Skylarian, technically, it is a game. Havok is a game engine. Its just that it has matured into something more. Its only 7 years old in its SDLC. So its not yet determined what it is
FreeWee Ling: Do you know his position at LL?
Em Larsson: I couldn't be on time, so I am lacking backgroud
Doran Forzane: Thats from a programming perspective
Sasun Steinbeck: I'll post a chat log Em, so you'll have all the stuff you missed
Doran Forzane: I dont even think LL understand what SL is
Skylarian Isachenko: Not going to argue with you. The game paradine does not work
quadrapop Lane: LL is aplatyform to play on - what you play is up to you - soem folks play games others [play business... just like internet
Em Larsson: great.. thanks Sasun.. on the Community Blog?
Sasun Steinbeck: yes, where Niko posted the recent update
Skylarian Isachenko: Lots of free accounts, come in, eat resoruces, then the RP sims die due to lack of support
Em Larsson: ah.. did not see it.. url?
Sasun Steinbeck: yes, the Community blog
Zachh Cale: Thanks so much Sasun and everyone! Hugs to alllll
Skylarian Isachenko: end result, net loss
Em Larsson: thank you!
Inovart Tedeschi is Offline
Em Larsson: Bye Zachh
Sasun Steinbeck: the general community blog is http://blogs.secondlife.com/community/community/blog
Maggi Mint: an inworld notification would be handy...I tend to avoid bloated bloggs
FreeWee Ling: Well this is all very exciting and scary.. heehee
Sasun Steinbeck: haha you're telling me!
Sasun Steinbeck: We have to do all the work!
Sasun Steinbeck: lol :)
Carly Frequency: thank you Sas --- I am going to head out - thank you Scott for hosting us
Sasun Steinbeck: thanks for coming!
Katerina Burner: take care everyone.. and if you like take a stroll and enjoy the exhibits
Em Larsson: Thanks Q
Ally Aeon: thank's Sasun and bye all
FreeWee Ling: Thank you for spearheading this, Sasun. I couldn;t think of a better representative.
Sasun Steinbeck: Please remember if you have any thoughts... notecard them and send them to me
Skylarian Isachenko: Have a grand day, I have a birthday party to attend to, we try to keep our staff stuffed with cake.
Sasun Steinbeck: well thank you, I hope to do a great job for you guys!
White Hyacinth: Thanks Sasun; bye all
Eliza Wierwight: yes thanks also to the Criss for hosting this communal area for us
FreeWee Ling: You always have.
Sasun Steinbeck: I will do my best not to let down my awesome gallery owners :)
Sasun Steinbeck: so don't worry, you will have a voice
Nima Benoir: You won't, don't worry!
Em Larsson: Thanks very much Sasun
Sasun Steinbeck: I've gotten some great ideas, I will comb though the chat log and pluck everything out and make sure the rest of the committee sees it
Sasun Steinbeck: and we can discuss all those ideas too
Nima Benoir: Thanks to Scotj, great meeting!
sandhya2 Patel: thank you
sandhya2 Patel: very good meeting
FreeWee Ling: Thank you all. Gotta get back to SL7B before it turns into a pumpkin...
Sasun Steinbeck: thank you, I hope this helped
Doran Forzane: lol
quadrapop Lane: hugs sasun and TY - you area vove of reason :)
Sasun Steinbeck: I know I don't have a lot of details to share but your feedback will help shape our plans for sure
Maggi Mint: TY for spearheading this Susan
Nima Benoir: oh lol, well he'll get to read my thinks later
quadrapop Lane: voice* even
Sasun Steinbeck: haha yes thanks to Scotj for hosting, I love this seating area
Molly Montale: quest for food. please have a good evening :)
sandhya2 Patel: i clicked on it and crashed
Molly Montale waves
Callipygian Christensen: thanks and good luck Sasun :)
Sasun Steinbeck: hopefully someday the LEA will have our own blog
Sasun Steinbeck: until then, the general community blog there is where to look
sandhya2 Patel: thank you
Sasun Steinbeck: thanks for coming everyone!
Sasun Steinbeck: that was fun
Maggi Mint: TY Susan
quadrapop Lane: wiki - sasun - do a LEA wiki page lol
Nima Benoir: Bye everyone, thanks again Sasun
Tondy Treves: Thank you, Sasun
Dragomir Greenwood: :-)
Eliza Wierwight: right , worky worky time for me , thanks again Sasun and the Criss , wishing everyone well ~Hugs Q ~
Sasun Steinbeck: I wish I wasn't leaving for so long, but oh well. I'm not really worried, the committee has some really smart and experienced artists on it
Sasun Steinbeck: I trust them to carry on while I'm gone :)
quadrapop Lane: I'll keep JJ on track for you :)
barry Richez: ty sasun and bye all
Sasun Steinbeck: hahaha good
barry's translator: ty and bye all Sasun
Sasun Steinbeck: yeah JJ has been great, a real good addition
Sasun Steinbeck: bye bye!
Em Larsson: I would feel better with you there, but life goes on, and this sounds like a fab holiday.
Em Larsson: Bye Sasun
Sasun Steinbeck: bye bye!
Peoney Feld: bye Sasun thank you very much
quadrapop Lane: he's gained alot of experience ina short time and has the rl management background
Sasun Steinbeck: yes a much needed break :)
Sasun Steinbeck: yes exactly!
Sasun Steinbeck: JJ and I agree on everything, so it's been a real pleasure!
Sasun Steinbeck: I need to put that in the LEA committee selection criteria, "all applicants must agree with Sasun on everything"
Peoney Feld: hahah
Peoney Feld: yes, Sasun...
Peoney Feld: yes
Peoney Feld: lol
quadrapop Lane: lol